Bus Robbery in Seattle

8 replies

• Shayne Simpson · 12/20/2013, 7:19:52 PM

  JT Taylor and I designed/taught the Bellingham Bus drivers a course on protection...the guy redirected the gun and went the other way well... thou he was Lucky the gun did not go off when it was redirected at others.... what i am most disappointed is the other passengers who had to get their stuff before getting off the bus... nothing you own is worth staying their with a gun that can go off... you can recover it later...

• Frank Pollara · 12/21/2013, 4:08:30 PM

  I ask students in class what would you do if you saw a man outside kicking your car door. 99% of the time they say let me think or hmmm.. It is very rare that I get an instant response. This is a sign that they have never really thought about what's worth fighting for. The man in the back with the red plaid coat and tan pants new the guy had the gun before anyone else I think. you can see him shifting his feet in Indecision. it’s not until the first man takes the gun that he does anything. the difference between the two men’s go button is huge.

• Bryan Zarnett · 12/21/2013, 8:42:00 PM

  The beauty of modern social media is that we are provided real-life examples of what can happen. We don't have to assume. We can see valid examples and the range of examples are fantastic. You can really throw out the "No one does it that way" comment.
  
  The guy (and everyone on the bus) was lucky (as Mr. Beldin suggests) had his attitude changed by the sudden counter-attack by the guy sitting down. It threw him into LA LA land in essence (out of time). If the fellow was a bit more aggressive in intentions, this would be a different video I think.
  
  The one thing I found most shocking was he put thought and time to put his phone/music device into his pocket while holding onto the gun rather than stop the fight. It was more important for the device not to fall/get lost than to counter the man and his gun. Materialistic as its best. I can always buy another phone/walkman/device.
  
  This is a great scenario drill though. I like the whole idea of a Ballistic Micro-fight or Panic Attack created by Tony Blauer. This is one scenario that could be done in any school with some chairs. A narrow pathway and see what happens. (1)Create a mob mentality where everyone wants to leave but you; and you are controlling the gun, (2) An instance where 2 or 3 people try to help you [not always helpful], (3) everyone ignores the struggle, and (4) everyone helps out.
  
  Some interesting stories to try and work through. Beginning of the "Rod" Cycle stories
  
  1) Your opponent has the gun pointed to your chest at your contact manipulation
  2) Your opponent has the gun pointed to your chest at your contact penetration
  3) Your opponent has the gun pointed at your forehead at contact penetration
  4) Your opponent has the gun pointed at your forehead at contact manipulation
  5) Your opponent has pointed a gun at your temple from the side at contact ...
  6) ...
  7) Your opponent has pointed a gun at your floating ribs from the side at ...
  8) ...
  9) Your opponent has a gun pointed at the back of your head from ...
  10) ...
  11) You are on your knees and your opponent has a gun pointed at your forehead
  12) You are on your knees and your opponent has a gun pointed at the side of your head
  13) You are at contact manipulation and your opponent tries to pull a gun from an appendix carry
  13) You are at contact manipulation and your opponent tries to pull a gun from a rear carry
  14) Insert bus problems here
  30) Insert rifle problems here
  40) Insert shotgun problems here
  
  
  
  (Figured I would start the idea as I find it interesting)

• Skip Hancock · 12/21/2013, 10:37:37 PM

  This type of discussion is exactly why I wanted to start posting these on our Forum.

  This is "reality" training.  It will help us all build better Decision Trees in the Cycle.

  As I have recently said, the Cycle is a book with 9 chapters - Chapter 1 is Attitude

  I will stop my opponent from hurting me" is the only thing written in the Chapter,

  When you watch everyone else on the bus, they have other priorities.

• Jack Oyler · 12/22/2013, 4:52:59 AM

  As the would be robber sticks the gun in the reader's face, and the seated reader reacts with a left hand gun grab, notice that as he stands he takes the time, lots of time in such a scenario, to fumble with his right hand in pocketing his ipod, and then attempts to punch the robber with a right. You probably laughed at this seeming absurdity, but there is ample documentation to support the fact that under pressure, auditory exclusions, tunnel vision, cognitive distortions, loss of voluntary body functions, fine and complex motor skill impairment and other mental, perceptual, emotional and physical changes can take place, even with seasoned police officers eand soldiers. We are a comical and comples species.

• Skip Hancock · 12/22/2013, 5:02:10 PM

  Jack,

  You are so right. "It is only a Skill if you can use it."  This is why the training of all Skills ( Basics, Principles of Motion and Principles of Self-Defense) must be accompanied by an equal amount of

  "experiencing" - that is Cycle training. The closer the training gets to reality the easier it is to get into the Flow and use all of your Skills.

• Bryan Zarnett · 12/23/2013, 1:35:05 AM

  Thanks for that reminder Jack. The Fight, Flight or Freeze element can often be ignored or forgotten when viewing these circumstances. These people are not trained for this circumstance so the lowest level of their training is what we get.

• Stephen Joers · 1/6/2014, 5:08:56 PM

  This is my favorite statement from people. I think the plain fact is that if you do not have enough experiences with the same outcome you don't know what you will do. When I hear this statement I always think back to a story told by Mr Pollara.
  
  This is the short version. If you would like to hear the whole, more entertaining, story ask Mr Pollara.
  Two men have a physical altercation on a job site. In the middle of the altercation one man bear hugs the other, picks him up off his feet, shakes him, then puts him down only to back up and resume the altercation. After the altercation he was asked why he did this and his response was, "I did what?!?!?" I don't think this is what he thought he would do but that is what happened.
  
  At first I was amused by the fact that the man took the time to put the phone in his pocket. I thought, "Why would anybody place more value on a phone than his own life?". Then it dawned on me, he didn't choose. He did the the things that he trains himself to do more than anything else. Every day he trains himself to NOT drop his expensive electronic device and when something requires his attention to put it away. His “helper hand” put the phone in his pocket while his “dominant hand” dominated. So if we judged him on his Training he passed. He actually got the phone into his pocket while dealing with a gun! Skip has said repeatedly, "What you train is what you will practice". If you don't have time to process the most logical solution you will drop to your most trained response. I guess I would have to know what his skills and experiences are before I can judge how well he used them. Looking at this from the 3rd point of view I see an important aspect of training that should be actively pursued.
  
  
  Stephen

Log in to reply.